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Post by Grandmthethird on Aug 9, 2013 22:35:50 GMT
My philosophy for any fighting game, don't look at the tier list; most people don't even understand what a tier list even means. Instead, find characters you like/relate to, and put in the time to learn them in and out. Even if the character(s) you love aren't top tier, they're all good in their own way, and at the end of the day it comes down to the individual skills of the people behind the controllers. Do I think Mishimas are very powerful characters? Yes. Do I think they are powerful because their "top tier?" No. The tier list is just a measurement of each character's potential in the hands of players who are all equal skill, which is unheard of. Despite the amazing tools that Mishimas have, they are lacking in a lot of the basic tools that make most characters in the game good. Like I said before, high risk, high reward. This, I still don't understand tier list. XDDD For most people tier lists don't matter, or rather, they shouldn't matter. Only when the highest of the high level players play does it really matter. Calling someone a tier whore is just a way to taunt them, That doesn't mean the Mishimas aren't the most OP characters in the game, they are. But what is meant by OP, well OP is over powered. It doesn't matter if your power level exceeds everyone else's by 100% or by 1%. If you are more powerful than the person below you then you are OP. Tier lists,think of it like this, you can have the worlds most powerful hyper cars. a lot of them are owned by people that have no idea and don't have the skill to get the best out of the car. They own these cars because they are told these cars are the best, but that doesn't make them a race car driver. (But the would still beat most people in a race from the lights) |
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Post by 50percentelf on Aug 10, 2013 0:29:09 GMT
Unfortunately mishimas differ slightly. A bad player with a Mishima is a bad and sometimes worse player.
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Post by Jac on Aug 10, 2013 1:40:29 GMT
They have had the same options in Tekken 6 with a few buffs and all of a sudden they are viewed as OP because of tier change.. Sense? |
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Post by 50percentelf on Aug 10, 2013 2:56:08 GMT
I think comparing this game to tekken 6 is where your going wrong. A lot more to this game than tekken 6
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electrickazama
Beginner 入門生
"Kyoufu Wo Oshiete Yarou"
Posts: 41
Likes: 2
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Post by electrickazama on Aug 10, 2013 3:12:34 GMT
Me too bro, I main Mishimas cause I like them not tier list. I like 12 to 15 characters, and all 5 Mishimas and Devil Jin are included. I hate most of the top tier characters. so I cannot be a tier freak. And I thought you deleted me off PSN. ? I never removed anyone in my psn, I'll check after vacation. I only like DJ, Jin and Kazuya. I'm not really like Heihachi just because the design not the tier list. |
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Post by Jac on Aug 10, 2013 4:27:16 GMT
I think comparing this game to tekken 6 is where your going wrong. A lot more to this game than tekken 6 Why not? It's true... Mishima's weren't S tier in Tekken 6 and i never heard anyone say they're OP. TTT2 buffs and tier change.. OP!!! Their options haven't changed at all it's just people's mentality towards higher tiered characters. |
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Post by HakuryuVision on Aug 10, 2013 5:36:03 GMT
Because a middle option takes away from the discussion. If people have to commit to one side then it forces people to justify each side and banter back and forth instead of taking the safe option. Really? But so far most people are actually talking about how fine/ok they are. XD (not sucking, not overpowered) I myself do think they are the strongest, but not unfair or overpowered. ...otherwise we would only see Mishimas on tourneys and streams. (No laws, Juns, Larses, etc) Heihachi rightfully belongs on top though, afterall he is the original King Of Ironfist, and he's back at his youth/peak. ; ) |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 10, 2013 8:33:42 GMT
Looks like I am not voting, If they were extremely overpowered, surely there would be more Mishima players on the leaderboard, All I see is Nina, Asuka and Lili players, And bad Mishima players should be a free win, If any of you come across My, as you say " OP Team" then be free to complain all you want, I don't spam EWGF, why continue to do a move that your opponent is constantly countering, I look for other ways to get at my opponent. When you lose to mishimas, do you get salty because their put in S-Tier. I Lose to LEO AND NINA a lot, and I don't get fucking salty.
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Post by 50percentelf on Aug 10, 2013 10:16:07 GMT
I think comparing this game to tekken 6 is where your going wrong. A lot more to this game than tekken 6 Why not? It's true... Mishima's weren't S tier in Tekken 6 and i never heard anyone say they're OP. TTT2 buffs and tier change.. OP!!! Their options haven't changed at all it's just people's mentality towards higher tiered characters. you misunderstand. Tekken 6 has a lot less depth than ttt2. Sure electrics got buffed, but if we took the same buff and put it in tekken 6 it wouldn't be the same? Why? Red life juggles, red life juggles, red life juggles. Oh and tag assaults. Out of all the characters in the game only 3 off the top of my head have i15 or less tag bufferable launchers. Out of these mishimas are the only ones who can do two then tag buffer. Their damage output and punishers, especially heihachi, are far superior compared to every other character in the game. It's not about mentality. It's about these being two very different games. At the highest level it's quite clear that mishimas are the top choice for those individuals. Why? Electrics, the single best launcher in the game. Wave dash Insinuating mixups by just dashing up to your opponent. High damage output Don't rely on gimmicks like 80% of the cast Hellsweeps. Heihachi has safe hell sweeps if its blocked after the first one. Great punishers , hit confirmable 1,1,2 much? Twin pistons for heihachi? Do I need to mention ws 1 to deaths fist with heihachi? This is scratching the surface. And if you even insinuate that t6 is comparable to tekken tag 2 then your not playing the same game. |
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Post by Jac on Aug 10, 2013 14:33:29 GMT
 Some characters punishers are on par with Mishima's excusing EWGF of course. Bob 1,1,2 f2,3 b2,2 df1,2 df2. i10-i15. Them being able to tag buffer at is the only advantage i've seen you post so far and it's hardly over powered.. Lars also has Arc Blast. Damage output comes from execution and if they aren't doing JF's mid combo then their combo's will be weak. Other characters can get higher damaged combo's with easier execution. Kuni gets 105 DJ gets 90+ from 3 EWGF's in combo. I did not compare these 2 games together i quite simply stated that Mishima's options have not changed. EWGF was still the best launcher in the game on T6. They still had WD pressure in T6. They didn't rely on gimmicks in T6. They still had great punishers in T6. How many Mishima's were at EVO in T6? |
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Post by 50percentelf on Aug 10, 2013 15:37:32 GMT
That framed data is wrong, actually try to test it in game. The red life factor is a huge roll. When your not suppose to be tag assaulting every juggle its important to take red health. Too many people overlook this portion of the game. The point is 1,1,2 is hit confirmable df 1,2 is hit confirmable If you try to punish something with other characters you have to fully commit and in turn risk getting punish if you choose wrong. With mishimas and especially heihachi it's much safer. Your still comparing Mishima in t6 to this game. This game is not t6. This game requires good tag bufferable launchers. If the same buff for electrics from ttt2 was put in t6 it wouldn't make them s tier. But because this is a game of health management electrics become x 10 how good they were. Also semi relevant video m.youtube.com/watch?v=zfes3CVO3U0&desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3Dzfes3CVO3U0Hopefully it works if your not on mobile like I am. |
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bladezzz x
Beginner 入門生
Power is everything.
Posts: 93
Likes: 3
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Post by bladezzz x on Aug 11, 2013 2:38:17 GMT
I like mishimas. Yay
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Post by Jac on Aug 11, 2013 16:07:24 GMT
That framed data is wrong, actually try to test it in game. The red life factor is a huge roll. When your not suppose to be tag assaulting every juggle its important to take red health. Too many people overlook this portion of the game. The point is 1,1,2 is hit confirmable df 1,2 is hit confirmable If you try to punish something with other characters you have to fully commit and in turn risk getting punish if you choose wrong. With mishimas and especially heihachi it's much safer. Your still comparing Mishima in t6 to this game. This game is not t6. This game requires good tag bufferable launchers. If the same buff for electrics from ttt2 was put in t6 it wouldn't make them s tier. But because this is a game of health management electrics become x 10 how good they were. Also semi relevant video m.youtube.com/watch?v=zfes3CVO3U0&desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3Dzfes3CVO3U0Hopefully it works if your not on mobile like I am. What's the problem with a 10 frame punish being hit comfirmable? Heihachi's has stricter timing df1,2, DJ's i believe is NC no matter how long you delay it. 1,1,2 if delayed too long is -17 df1,2 is -13 (?) Ok i agree with you on red life thing. As you said it is something people overlook and that is what i have done. Red life isn't my focus, i am more focused on damage. Show me a combo video of Mishima's WITHOUT walls WITHOUT balcony/floor breaks. You'll see them only just break 100 and Heihachi can get to 120+ |
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Post by 50percentelf on Aug 11, 2013 16:17:58 GMT
To be honest taking away balcony/floor/wall is really a problem. The whole point is if you put other characters in the same situation it's impossible for them to do the same thing. Although I really believe this game should be viewed in teams tier lists.
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Post by Jac on Aug 11, 2013 17:02:14 GMT
Lars, Leo, Bruce all insane amount of damage pre bound and at the wall is another story.
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Post by 50percentelf on Aug 11, 2013 18:29:17 GMT
That's why those characters are typically put under mishimas. Leo in my opinion is the most well rounded character.
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Hades
Beginner 入門生
TeamMashFTW's War Drummer
Posts: 16
Likes: 1
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Post by Hades on Aug 14, 2013 14:27:48 GMT
lol @everybody who thinks they are not OP. not broken but clearly the best characters in the game (poor buurs, lings, alisa etc)
best punishers in the game by far (Kaz can launch at -13, standing and crouching and TP is not even launchable)
EWGF(i think i don't have to go there + it tracks very well)
ff3 (mid launcher which is safe)
Heis HS 4 follow ups are both safe,
DVJ and KAZ annoyingly good low pokes (db2 and db4)
damage and red life output is good,
Wavedash EWGF and ff+3 mixup the biggest BS in the game.
you don't even have to EWGF -15 with DVK and DVJ
HC 1,1,2 is braindead easy and Hei TP is also HC btw.
Heis ff+2 is mid and -547568483 yes but so much pushback
i could continue...
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Post by theroyalmailx on Aug 14, 2013 14:39:52 GMT
I just loooove kazuya  |
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Post by Jac on Aug 14, 2013 17:20:38 GMT
lol @everybody who thinks they are not OP. not broken but clearly the best characters in the game (poor buurs, lings, alisa etc) best punishers in the game by far (Kaz can launch at -13, standing and crouching and TP is not even launchable) EWGF(i think i don't have to go there + it tracks very well)
ff3 (mid launcher which is safe)
Heis HS 4 follow ups are both safe,
DVJ and KAZ annoyingly good low pokes (db2 and db4)
damage and red life output is good,
Wavedash EWGF and ff+3 mixup the biggest BS in the game.
you don't even have to EWGF -15 with DVK and DVJ
HC 1,1,2 is braindead easy and Hei TP is also HC btw.
Heis ff+2 is mid and -547568483 yes but so much pushback
i could continue...I'm sorry. How is WD EWGF to ff3 even a mix up? EWGF is high and ff3 is mid.. There's only one possible way of you being launched and that's ff3 because you duck. EWGF will whiff and you can punish and HS will be blocked and you can punish. I know they are the best. At -15 anyone has an easy mode launch. Hei's TP has strict timing and is -13 i believe. Hei is just a ridiculous character. The only blunt thing i can say is, don't play unsafe. |
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Post by theroyalmailx on Aug 15, 2013 14:15:05 GMT
Saying that someone can track a move is a load on bollocks aswell, I mean I use Bryan and kazuya , people have said I over use snake edge when I dont, and it's funny because it's an easy excuse. As for saying EWGF is easy to track, has nobody ever heard of mix up? I'v caught so many ' pro ' players out its un real. So for framed data, I think it's seriously weak. Every char I have used I have picked up and used myself, my set up aren't copied from some silly idiot on a website. When I was learning Tekken we all used too sit in the living room betting money on outcome of fights and everyone knows when money is involved everyone gets good  . As for OP chars, I'm sorry but the women in Tekken are such douche bags, I mean I don't know what the moves are called, but when Jaycee has the opponent in the air and she does that punch that back hand crap? Omg it's so fucking overused, yet people say using the laws is wrong? I really could go on. |
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